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Post by Billy Tops on May 18, 2003 2:53:12 GMT -5
Due any of you guys remember any of these real old time greats.
Is it just me or do these guys seem to have something that the modern day greats for the most part don't have?
My partial list is
ALLISON*, Glenn BLUTH*, Ray BOMAR, Buddy BUNETTA, Bill BURTON. Nelson Sr. CAMPI, Lou CARTER*, Don CASTELLANO, Graz DAY, Ned FALCARO, Joe FARAGALLI, Lindy FAZIO*, Buzz GIBSON, Therm GOLEMBIEWSKI, Billy HENNESSEY, Tom HOOVER, Dick KAWOLICS, Ed LILLARD, Bill LUBANSKI, Ed McMAHON, Junie NAGY, Steve NORRIS, Joe SMITH*, Harry SPARANDO, Tony SPINELLA, Barney VARIPAPA, Andy WEBER*, Dick WELU*, Billy WILMAN, Joe
These are basically all pre 1960 greats, who else would any of you guys add to this list.
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Post by Louis on May 20, 2003 13:14:16 GMT -5
Now you are really going back. I had the pleasure of bowling with some of those greats later in there careers. they were great bowlers. it those days you had only rubber balls and bowled on laquer lanes . you also had to be very accurate.Which leads me to believe the older bowlers were so good becouse they had to hit a mark not an area.The recent greats of the game became so good becouse they were use to hitting a board or two, when the lanes changed they got more area and used it . the bowlers of today needed that area becouse thats all they know. and if conditions were tough they are just not accustomed to being able to hit the one or two board area.
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Post by IBEATLOUCAPASSO on May 20, 2003 15:58:40 GMT -5
LOU
Let me set something straight. You had talent but you always squeezed when you needed it.you were a decent bowler. like a triple a baseball player. you were never great. you are a dreamer. as for the conditions, yeah the scores are higher today only because the balls hit harder. the lanes are not easier. if they were so hard in the old days, how did glenn allison shoot 900? how did the budweiser team average 250. how did mark roth average 218 on tour in the 1970's? walter averaged 222 this year. not a big difference? everyone in the old days played the same line. you only had to be good at one thing, ram it up ten. now a days you have to be able to play 30 different angles. the game is much harder today, but the scores are higher because of the balls hitting harder. if you average 230 and are high average or average 203 and are high average, whats the difference, you are still high average. please come back to the game, i want to drill you again like i did at maple years ago. tell cannizzaro he still sucks.
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Post by Louis on May 20, 2003 16:27:27 GMT -5
Please identify yourself . I am trying to remember who beat me 10 years ago SINCE I MOVED OUT OF N.Y. 13 YEARS AGO!!!!!! But I will say it is possible I was beat at Maple. I am sure someone must have won a match from me there. And you make a good point about the avg. then and now. but unfortunatly conditions did not hold up as well in the late 70's becouse the finish was not as stable and the shot became spotty. I think it was called muralane or something. I think you can agree the scores are higher and the equiptment is much better today. these resin balls can go very long even on dry conditions, where when i bowled you could get instant hook even with blue dots. And please do not pick on Joe he is probobly the most dedicated bowler in the history of the game. He was not a natural talent he had to work to become good. please if you do not want to give your name on the site please e mail me @ lcapasso331@hotmail.com I would love to talk about old times "even if i did lose " you should be proud if you beat me at maple only lost 3 matches once to horn which I got even with the saturday after. I believe Snake beat me one time and you if you say so. Thanks for responding hope you will e mail me
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Post by IBEATLOUCAPASSO on May 20, 2003 16:50:22 GMT -5
NEVER SAID I BEAT YOU 10 YEARS AGO. PLEASE READ BEFORE YOU MAKE AN ASS OF YOURSELF. YOU LOST WAY MORE THAN 3 MATCHES.SNAKE WAS BETTER THAN YOU, HORN WAS BETTER, SPALLONE WAS BETTER SO ON AND SO ON. CANNIZZARO IS ONE OF THE WORST BOWLERS THAT EVER LIVED. NO MATTER HOW HARD HE WORKED, HE NEVER GOT BETTER.
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Post by Louis on May 20, 2003 16:57:55 GMT -5
You also say I choked Dont think so. I won many tournaments and many a match game i was far from a choker . I accomplished many a things in a 6 year period from when I was 16 to 22 when I quit the game. After 1982 the times I bowled were for short periods of time a year here or there and never even got back to my best form. But thank god this is america and you can write what you like But the truth should not be tainted. If you beat me in a match congradulations . But I guarentee you it was after 1982 becouse the only match i lost befor that was a 5 game freezout to the greatest of them all Richie Hornreich. If you won It was probobly late 80' early 90's and for probobly less than 50 a game. that was all anyone bowled for at maple by that time anyway. That was not action that was killing time. Maple had some great bowlers in its time Petraglia, Val, Tom Camillari,John Colossi, Bob Spallone the list is long. I have not Disrespected any of the bowlers i have written about so please as my father once told me if you have nothing nice to say dont say it. Calling me a Dreamer hMMMMM. lets see winning your 1st pba tournament as a pba professional thats a dream .OOOOOPS sorry thats a reality I did it. Bowling back to back 300's in a match against a pba member at 16 years old OOOPS thats a reality (sorry Tusa) Should I go on!!! the only reason I was triple a as you call it is becouse my father died when i was 22 and I had to support myself and made a decision that a job made more sence!!! When you bowled me I was still beating top bowlers and making money in tourny's but it was not my JOB! If you bowled at Maple ask the Master Who where the best 3 ever from maple..The master being Joe s his responce would be Petraglia Me and Probobly Colossi!!! There were none Better. I remember when I decided to bowl ,John Colossi gave me a ball and showed me how to drill it it was the 1st time i had seen a urethane ball. He had become a great bowler from the last time i had seen him he was about 13 then now he was 18 all grown up and was a solid bowler.
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Post by Louis on May 20, 2003 17:03:53 GMT -5
Just say who you are. Spallone wouldnt bowl me and neither would horn. Snake would but i could have lived off him. Not becouse I was better just becouse he could not beat be.. plain and simple ask him. We bowled quite a few doubles matches together and we never lost. especially in staten island. I remember at least 3 different times we bowled .we were an unbeatable doubles team. ask him. the reason is we respected each other and trusted each others game. As I said I beat snake alot but He was a great bowler and unlike me still is and for my paison joe well snake still makes mincemeat out of him.. lol
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A friend of his father
Guest
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Post by A friend of his father on May 20, 2003 17:50:41 GMT -5
Whoever you are I dont think you beat Lou. you talk like you are a maple rat. Spallone was good, Horn was great Snake very good. But none and mark my words had his talent,his heart or his will to win. And win with Flair! He did have a big mouth but he really could back himself up. I saw him at maple about 8 years ago he picked up Santini' ball and and started throwing some shots on 27 and 28 all the BIGSHOT potgame bowlers were there and a handful of onlookers. after about 4 balls he just started striking and there was a buzz at maple and about 25 people came over to watch and say hello. Including the owner John. He really was something special on the lanes. I bowled in a league with his father, he was a nice man. I think when his father died so did his heart and his game.He would come in Maple about once a year and wouldnt bowl for about 4 years after his death. If things were different I believe he would of won his share of PBA events.
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Post by guest on May 20, 2003 18:58:00 GMT -5
i beat lou capasso has some good and bad points. the bad point is that the game was super tough in 1958. bud team had weber, carter, bluth, etc. bluth shot 834, unheard of in those days. he forgot every bowler on that team was great. today the balls and certain conditions make the scores much much higher. today's game is more complicated. under lacquer, one ball and the adjustment was always to the left when they started hooking more. today these balls push the oil around, causing the lanes to change more and the adjustments at times could be to the right. mark had one exceptional year in 1979 and the average was 221 with a yellow dot, he also won 8 stops. other than that year, until resin, the high was between 215-219. wrw averaged close to 223 or 224 this year but was almost two pins better than the field. of course he is the best in the world and top 3 of all time. last year he was 227 and parker 229 a few years ago. know your facts. and if you beat lou, how come he never got a return? i DO not know him or saw him bowl but if he beat kidder as he so stated, he would not have backed down if you gave him a return match. maybe you still feared him!
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Post by guest on May 20, 2003 19:14:32 GMT -5
lou, if you ask joe s who had the most talent from maple it would be the horn. the best was johnny because of his 15 wins on tour. too bad you are not old enough to have seen horn in his heyday in the 60s. gambling was his downfall, track, cards, ac etc. when you knew him he was half the bowler. some stats on horn, in 1963 or 1964, he he averaged 217 at bedford, unheard of in those days. he was the first to average a deuce at that dungeon bowlmor, 1966, 206. he won the vargo one year on that four pound wood and shot 1060 or 1080. at the age of 16 he finished 10th in the world's invitational against the best in the world. the horn probably does not remember these stats because he never gave a shit. he had a super high backswing in his day and could play anywhere on the lane from the ditch to 25. what a waste of talent. he is a nice guy, never bragged how good he was. alot do not remember. burton challenged him to a three game total wood in vegas one year when richie toured for awhile for 1g. richie said where he came from, one game at a time. richie put 10g on the table and burton pulled the invisible act. this was from the mouth of horn. how can you not believe him when he's probably stuck 1m in ac. enuf for now.
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Post by Louis on May 20, 2003 23:48:36 GMT -5
Dear guest you are a man who speaks the truth richie as I said was the best i started watching him in about 69 he was awesome I know many of the old stories and rithie never bragged but I was privy to those stories. We hung together for a while when i was in my prime. we were close I am godfather to his son. there were few that could play anywhere on the lanes like him.
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Post by GUEST on May 21, 2003 12:19:31 GMT -5
Louis thank you. Very few remember how phenomenal he was. So of course you knew when you played him he was not as good. He was better in 1967 than in 1969. In 69 he started going downhill. In the early 70s at least at Fiesta he did not bowl much, at least with his hands. He bowled with the broom and was the best I saw. 170-180. You probably remember Jamsie- he was almost as good with the broom-170. Prior to the early 70s the horn never knew me. Just used to watch him in the back. A story I'll never forget. One sunday morning after the fiesta action we're playing our usual dice game in some back alley not far from Fiesta. Richie went broke at Fiesta, lost, to him, a small $500. He's begging Rabbit whom you may remember for $10 to roll the dice. About an hour later, Rabbit lends the horn the $10. Richie picks up the dice, a number of passes and he's up $500. Now he's even for the day. A normal gambler would have quit after getting even for the day. Not the horn. About an hour later, the $500 was gone and he owed Rabbit the $10. Those were the days. I was impressed with Richie at Central, where he beat everybody including the great Jim Godman, because he would bet $1g where $100 was alot to almost anybody else betting. And he was so good in the tenth. A strike was a lock. Do not know how he did it, but I saw him make the 7-10 in the tenth for a grand. A waste of talent. Gambling did that to so many, Lemon, Berardi, and the list goes on and on.
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Post by Louis on May 22, 2003 18:02:28 GMT -5
Horn and myself went to Laguardia the 1st time I was bowling a guy named dirt for about 1g agame fornt and back. I win 4 straight and the horn was shooting dicein the back. after that match is when I bowled behrbaum he beats me the 1st game for 300 i won the next 2 beating him by 30 each game and he quits we win about 4500 that night 3 way split .next morning we go to bridge lanes and look for action but there was none so he takes my to the track. he is broke by the 7th and we play a $50 late double he picks the 1st race i pick the 2nd I know nothing about horses so i pick the horse nicky santagata is riding we hit the double pay about 65 dollars so he now has about 800 we get home around 7 and says lets go to the meadowlands. we do,he goes broke in 3 races!!! that was just richie. I never knew berardi to gamble outside of bowling and joe and i hung together for a very short while the first year he got married becouse i got married the same time. Joe was so smooth and threw a great ball. He and I closed more than 1 bar in those days.
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Post by Senior Citizen on May 22, 2003 20:29:56 GMT -5
Great story about the horn. all the money he blew in ac. His first inheritance as told to me by the count, jerry simonelli whom I'm sure you knew. Richie inherited about 700g. The first week he blows 20g in ac. Six months later he tells the count I knew I blew 20g the first week but I never thought I'D blow another 680g in six months. Heard his father knew that the horn would blow it all, so he left him a second inheritance mainly for Richie's son. As for Berardi he now lives in S.I. and sells MRI equipment. I heard he quit the tour ten years ago, because his wife was blowing it all. Recently, I was told by a good source that it was berardi blowing all the money. I knew him in the early seventies when he first came around and then for a couple of years after. those days never a big gambler. A hof with 9 wins. He was the first bowler I saw about 20 years ago, win a summer stop playing inside of 25. That line was unheard of before resin.
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Post by SC on May 24, 2003 16:24:51 GMT -5
The great action bowler, charlie faino, 1980 his home lanes in Philly where he was 230. Somebody bets Charlie $100 that he could not bowl 700 in the nude. They close the doors. Charlie had 700 by the 6th or 7th frame of the third game. The loser told Charlie, next week no socks. What a character Faino was. Last I heard last year that he has cancer but is in remission. Central lanes, 1967, Hazelcorn, whom I thought was skinnier than Lemon(he weighed 130 lbs and 5'10")dirty willie's buddy for all that remember came up with $5 in his pocket. He wins his first bet, parlays and wins the next six for $640. Only time I ever saw that. I also saw him the same year at Central bet on a match where the bowlers split eight games. No bowler won more than two in a row. The only winner was hazelcorn betting in the back. He kept switching bets and did the impossible, he won 8 bets. Those days we'll take to the grave.
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Post by LC on May 26, 2003 9:31:18 GMT -5
Faino was a character and a great bowler. I did bowl him 1 time but at the time I did not know who he was.Thank God. By the time we bowled the lanes were not condusive to a full roller and I had the edge. we also bowled doubles as teammates once after some tourney I think it was carolier. I hope he Is feeling well Great bowler and person.
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Post by LC on Jun 4, 2003 15:35:18 GMT -5
Sorry to hear about faino I hope he recoups fast great bowler and character. Now SC WE must know each other. but you still wont tell me your name. you can e mail me direct. and yes I know Jerry I practically grew up at bklyn bowlmart and joe s pro shop. you keep saying horn as top bowler from maple but reality he was from leemark. there were alot of bowlers came to the classic league to bowl like Bonelli to name one great bowler but he was not from maple. Once again the maple crew Rags, simo, picone, o,grady, me,colossi joe s,val,cammelari,lautoto these were bowlers from maple since I started bowling there in 1968. alot were great at maple but alot were great other houses also. I liked bowling at bay ridge very much I won 2 10 game marathons there. and probobly 5 or six king of the hills there I loved bowling action at laguardia and garden city. Becouse I could only get cheap matches at maple or bay ridge not many people would bowl me there Kenmore was a good action house for me I could get into 4 th and 5th arrow and overpower the lanes but that dried up quick, one night I beat Buffalo,archie young.Clarence and some guy chuck they brought in at 5 am to bowl me. won 14 games in a row. as you can imagine I could not get a match there after that.
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Post by SC on Jun 4, 2003 15:56:28 GMT -5
We do not know each other. The years that you were great. I was not around. We just know or knew the same characters, I mean bowlers. Faino was so much tougher under lacquer when the full roller worked.
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Post by LC on Jun 4, 2003 16:34:43 GMT -5
You are correct 1st time i saw him was at a marathon in south jersey I was about 16 years old joe s me horn and about 3 or 4 other guys bowled this marathon and charlie crossed with me. down the track for 10 games accurate, smooth he was great. the next day we all met again at elizebeth lanes 20 games in 24 hours back to back marathons with no sleep. I was young and strong than and that wore me out. my thumb was sore cut and throbbing. but THOSE WERE THE BEST TIMES EVER!!!!
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Post by SC on Jun 5, 2003 12:24:22 GMT -5
Well thank you LC. you are the only person here that remembers how good Faino was under lacquer in the 70s. He was the toughest mf around these parts. Quick story. george pappas pbahof and his backer walked into lyons one friday night early 70s looking to bowl charlie. I'm waiting to keep score because I wanted my $50 in the middle. Practice begins. about 20 minutes. Faino hitting the pocket blindfolded. Pappas puts his ball in his bag and walks out with his backer. Charlie stands up on the front desk and yells as pappas hits the door, "George Pappas pba star you suck." Practice and out. A rarity in the real days of action. Today, it happens alot.
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Post by LC on Jun 5, 2003 13:29:30 GMT -5
around 1978 to 1981 not sure when somebody tried to put amatch together me against charlie. I knew charlie at this time and he knew me. neither of us wanted to bowl each other but faino starts to egg these guys in a doubles match and basically same thing happened charlie striking down the oil line and me opening up the lane they packed up and left. funny part of the story was about 1985 we meet this guy again me and c bank at garden state bowl they called him cherry pie, he remembers me by the backswing and we bowle.dead lefty shot, but schmuck that i am i still bowl. I shoot 300 the 1st game and they still want to go. so i shoot 256 AND LOSE 236 and HE MISSES A 7 PIN ON PURPOSE TO KEEP IT CLOSE and I smile and leave. Got even with him at country lanes though. anyway Charlie could split a board and if he needed 2 in the tenth 90 percent he would flush it.
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Post by the cane on Jul 11, 2003 13:37:12 GMT -5
i know both and heres a charlie story . in vegas must be 88 , high roller , he is bowling this guy a 3 game total for 1000 , the guy from texas , had come 2nd the year before , and has charlie by 85 going into the 3 rd game. charlie starts with first 6 takes the lead into the tenth, but charlie though the match was over. i told him its still in the wood , hes up 5 he strikes out, the other guy needs double and 6 to win , throws a colonal sanders with a wing , as snake screamed on the final throw for a tie 2 4 5 8 7 the wing for those of you who dont know col sanders founder of kfc that was chicken in a bucket with a wing the 7 i dont remember who won the one game roll off, so maybe charlie ran out of steam, or i would have remembered
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Post by thecane on Jul 18, 2003 19:29:01 GMT -5
lenny,how's the buff doing these days.FRUIT SALAD. I check out the action bowlers site every once in awhile and have to laugh about the things they say about who was the best.mike was good, so was ritchie and ralph dewey jake kenny joe s,kidder but who went home with the money was the best and you know and for sure i know ,that when you don't know when to quit that makes you a slight Fish not a tuna because all of these mentioned could bowl. Enough said about bowlihg. if you here from buff tell him i said hello. www.tournament 900@aol.com,you got married and i didn't get an invite HA,HA looking at another site i seen red bassetts name he was blinder than a bat but could hit a gnats ass at 40ft.haven't heard his name in at least 15,20 yrs. brings back the memories of good times and good action and the sun coming up and time to go home and sleep. bowl on the old mans tour now just won my first title in brentwood (northern)ca. still bowling and beating the kids on the regional level(just finished 2nd) hope to do the same on the jr. tour this winter starting in jan.say hello to all my critics on the net that think the other guys were the best just tell them whose still here doing it and who is not that should prove that my knowledge and skill is beyond theirs, rubber,plastic,soaker,bleeders,lt48's urathane ,2piece 3 piece and now the load as I call them,getting better with age,the modern era the old era whatever action is action when to get on a lane and when to get off is the sign of who the best is not some one who lets himself get beat to the tune of all his money thats a fish,tuna,and more then 5 in a row more then once is the ultimate WHALE you chase them with a passion. now that the record is set to the cane who does alot of the reporting to the action people,each person that said they made alot of money on me in the middle that is not true I took all bets and my memory is good,exact dates not so sharp on but matches right on win or lose,i never lost to ritchie, twice to mike in singles,but never lost in doubles and that was a whole bunch of times. when mike and i were partners we were unbeatable then he listened to his so called friends and said you want to bowl me and that was his downfall,i'm into making money not beating someone just taking their money. I didn't like taking mikes money but his buddys now that was a different story. here is the story from the horses mouth, in an e mail i received today. if you dont know who wrote the letter , you dont know bowlers , or action bowlers. out of all the action bowlers mentioned on these boards he has to be the best for longevity . 45 years that i know , so the money is still coming in as you can read. how many action shooters, whether it was the count gengler , iggy or anyone else you know can make this claim? i dont know one n y or other state, maybe if there is another action shooter with at least 46 years action, want to take ernie on please leave your name and i'm sure he would give any 60 year old a run. thats right 60 this year happy belated birthday fruit salad!!!!
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Post by SC on Jul 19, 2003 2:34:58 GMT -5
The originator of fruit salad did lose to Richie on more than one occassion. How could you forget? You had maybe 6 tour wins in your career. Lemon had that in less than ten years including two majors in one year. You are smarter because you are still here. You were not a degenerate gambler like lemon and richie. And covering all bets please. $100 was a good bet for you in Central. Richie, Lemon and if you remember RC bet a grand many many many times. for my money you were great because I never went home a loser betting on you in Central. it was tough to get a bet on Richie or lemon because they were the best around and always the favorites. Remember when you and richie chopped up godman and lemon at central. Richie was the anchor.
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Post by DON L on Mar 21, 2004 23:01:55 GMT -5
LOU Let me set something straight. You had talent but you always squeezed when you needed it.you were a decent bowler. like a triple a baseball player. you were never great. you are a dreamer. as for the conditions, yeah the scores are higher today only because the balls hit harder. the lanes are not easier. if they were so hard in the old days, how did glenn allison shoot 900? how did the budweiser team average 250. how did mark roth average 218 on tour in the 1970's? walter averaged 222 this year. not a big difference? everyone in the old days played the same line. you only had to be good at one thing, ram it up ten. now a days you have to be able to play 30 different angles. the game is much harder today, but the scores are higher because of the balls hitting harder. if you average 230 and are high average or average 203 and are high average, whats the difference, you are still high average. please come back to the game, i want to drill you again like i did at maple years ago. tell cannizzaro he still sucks.
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Post by OLDTIMER on Mar 22, 2004 20:44:39 GMT -5
The last message was written by one freakin douchbag who was never around when bowling was tough.
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Post by HarryBar on Mar 24, 2004 12:25:31 GMT -5
How can those of us who were there explain how much of the action was mental?
When you had 200 or more guys in Central at four in the morning all looking for an edge.
As the saying goes "priceless"
HarryBar
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Post by thecane on Aug 20, 2004 16:12:04 GMT -5
regarding , the story about richie, blowing 700g in 6 months, is true but thats not the whole story, since i was told by his accountant ronnie, that he was given the smallest part by dad morris, who left close to 15 mil. richie supposedly was left 4 intervels of 500gs to be spread out every 5 years or so , so that he wouldnt blow it . the 1st blowing was the 1st 500gs with a borrow against the balance being 200gs of the 2nd installment to total 700, so the count was partially right from my hearsay. as to what happened to the balance i dont know , and i would guess you wouldnt find out from richie, or his former accountant ronnie c , since they had split , when i had heard that info close to 20 years ago. the cane
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Post by islandguy on Apr 7, 2009 13:41:23 GMT -5
this guest has pipe dreams... he wont identify himself...he is an A&& HOLE
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Post by islandguy on Apr 7, 2009 13:43:15 GMT -5
Let me qualify my coment........ E-mail me... OR,, post here... I WILL PUT my shoes on at 62 yrs old... you Punk... if you identify yourself...
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