Post by Zoo Master on Nov 23, 2009 0:24:13 GMT -5
Memory Lane: Back in the Action With Del Ballard Jr.
9/10/2009
One of the most storied places in bowling lore is reserved for the legendary "action bowling" scene that flourished in the New York City area throughout the 1950s and 1960s. One man who remains unimpressed, though, is PBA Hall of Famer Del Ballard Jr. "New York's overrated," Ballard said recently when he sat down with BOWL.com and took us back to a time in Texas when a 17-year-old Norm Duke averaged 250 standing on one lane and lofting the ball over the gutter cap of the next, when even the flawless David Ozio's 230 average that particular night was not enough to win a single game as Ballard went penniless betting on him, when hardly anyone beyond the county line was yet to hear the names of Duke, Ozio or Ballard. But by the time those names were known from coast to coast, New York, too, got a taste of Texas action when Ballard and the boys from back home stopped in at the famed Deer Park Lanes in Long Island for action whenever the PBA Tour came to the northeast. And it was there, in a center so wild and crowded that spectators found their seats on ball returns to get a glimpse of the action and people held the door when players of Ballard's stature arrived, that Ballard understood why New York is the place where action bowling is done like nowhere else. Here, Del Ballard Jr. takes a trip back down memory lane and remembers a co*ky Bob Vespi standing on a ball return in Deer Park with his hands in the air to taunt a rattled Rudy "Revs" Kasimakis after a clutch double in the tenth, the action matches Norm Duke bowled for as much as $10,000 a game, and many more great memories from his days in the action.
Del, you hear a lot of action stories out of the northeast, but every once in a while you also hear stories out of Texas involving the likes of Norm Duke, David Ozio, yourself and others. What memories do you have of bowling action down in Texas back in the day?
DB: New York's overrated. Norm and I go way back. Seven straight weeks he came over after we bowled league on Tuesday nights, and we bowled for $1,000 a game, $2,000 on totals. So, yeah, you can say we've been around.
And this was in the early 1980s, before you went on tour?
DB: 1980, '81. I was about 18. This was before I went out on tour. Norm might have just gone out, he's about a year younger than me. The first real action match I remember, Norm bowled David Ozio at a bowling center in Corpus Christi right after a regional in 1981 at Buckeye Lanes. It was a two-sided AMF place, and they hooked a mile. Anytime you bowled there the humidity and salt water were horrible for the lanes and the surface was terrible. I don't know what they were bowling for but it was a lot of money, and there was another guy from the Houston area named Larry Thompson who was a huge action bowler back then too.
The three of them got down on a pair and I was helping them keep score. This was like my second regional ever and I am down there helping them keep score, and of course I am betting on David Ozio, he looked like the greatest bowler I had ever seen. Norm was averaging 250 and they were hooking so much he was standing on the left lane approach bowling on the right lane, walking around the ball return and throwing it over the gutter cap. At 17 years old he knew how to do that. And all I remember Larry Thompson doing is turning his back and looking at us and saying ‘Now how am I supposed to beat that?' And Ozio averaged 230 and couldn't win a game. That was one of the most remarkable performances I have ever seen. I lost all the money I had in my pocket, all $250 of it.
So you were betting on Ozio against Duke?
DB: Oh, absolutely! You would watch Ozio throw it and think ‘How could this guy ever lose?' And I knew Norm was good but that day I learned that it was tough to beat Norm Duke. I didn't bowl Ozio much action, but I bowled a lot of action against Norm. Joe Vito used to come up on Tuesday nights too from San Antonio. Joe Vito and Norm Duke were the two biggest action bowlers. You ask anyone from Texas and they will tell you Joe Vito was the best money bowler ever. He was just phenomenal. Those were fun times, fun times. I bowled Rudy a couple times too.
Rudy Revs?
DB: Yeah, I bowled him a couple times up at Deer Park Lanes in Long Island. When the tour was up there we'd always bowl action. I bowled a lot of action up there. Guys like Bob Perry, Rudy a couple times, Bob Vespi bowled Rudy there. That was a great match.
What do you remember about the Vespi-Rudy matches? You hear stories about those two bowling action to this day.
DB: Oh, they were great matches. Great matches. Not only did I see those matches, I was backing those matches. I had to be there for the action! I was always around where the action was. This was when Vespi was good on tour and all I remember is that it was crazy. People were all over the approaches sitting on the ball returns trying to watch, sitting on the pairs. It was crazy.
Now, every time Rudy needed one he would throw it right through the face. And all I remember is Vespi got up and doubled in the tenth to make him get the first one, and he turned around and stood up on the ball return with his arms out and said ‘Well, we know whose shot it is now! And we know what's gonna happen! Does everybody in here know what's gonna happen?' And Rudy throws it right through the face.
But Rudy himself has such a huge reputation as an action bowler, so I would imagine that there were nights when Rudy was unbeatable too?
DB: Well I would imagine so, yes, but it also depends on who you're bowling. You know, when the tour comes to town it's a different story than when you're bowling local people. I mean, that's a little different. I don't know where Rudy developed all the reputation from because I wasn't around. But when the tour came to town we didn't care who he was. We didn't care who we were bowling against.
You say "We." Who else was involved in these action matches when the tour came to Long Island?
DB: Well it was me, Norm, Ozio would bowl action up there, Doug Kent is a great action bowler. Now, Norm got matches that I was never a part of, matches where they were bowling for big money.
How much money are we talking about?
DB: Oh, between $5,000 and $10,000.
Per game?
DB: Oh, yeah! But see they'd do it differently there. Up there they do a deal where you get all the money on one side, and then the other side has to match that money. That's how you get the fans involved. You go around and get a hundred bucks a piece from thirty guys, I mean, that's $3,000. The bowler would put up about $1,500 of his own money and collect another $3,000 or $4,000 from the back and now you're bowling for $5,000.
But it's not like the bowlers themselves are bowling for all that money to come into their pocket, right? Not when all these other people are betting on the match.
DB: Right. The bowler puts up the amount of money he wants to make, or the bowler's backer.
So if Norm Duke is paying $1,500 out of pocket but other people are betting $3,000 on the match Norm himself is just bowling for the $1,500, right?
DB: Exactly. That's how they get the whole bowling center involved.
So that's why the whole place became such a riot?
DB: Right. East coast action is different from the action down here. Up there they involved the crowd. Nothing is better than walking into Deer Park where there are about 2,000 people in a place that normally holds about a thousand people all up on the approaches and they hold the door open for you when you walk in. I mean they actually make you feel pretty special, because you're the action. That was the fun part. We used to have a great time. Great times.
Now that would get me back into bowling more. That's when it's fun.
Well what happened to those times, Del? Why have they gone away?
DB: Well, if you can "trick" it and you can do the right thing and average 270, it doesn't matter how good you are. It's more about how you can find the right trick.
What do you mean by "find the right trick"?
DB: Well, like guys I bowled with up in Long Island. They had this little trick gutter shot. Norm is one of the best gutter players of all time and he had a hard time beating the guy because it's like boards one and two hooked, but if you hit one too early it went through the nose, and if you hit three you would miss the headpin to the right. Norm practiced the gutter shot when he was a kid, he grew up on the same lane machine that I did, but he grew up on the one-to-one pattern, not the three-to-three pattern.
Does your wife Carolyn Dorin-Ballard ever bowl any action?
DB: Oh, yeah, locally around here when they're bowling pot games and stuff like that.
Well I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not bowling Carolyn for any amount of money.
DB: I know I can't beat her. She just laughs at me.
What about Del Ballard Jr. in 2009? Are you still bowling much these days, looking for any action at all?
DB: Oh, no. I spend all my extra time hanging out with my daughter. If there was some action going on I wouldn't mind going a little bit. Not bowling, just betting on the action. I like the action. Just a few years ago I bowled a couple of guys, Alex Cavagnaro and Rubio when I was bowling up there at Carolier. We were there and went over to Strike 'N Spare or whatever it was, and Chris Johnson and I went over to bowl them and you know I'm not any good anymore, everybody beats me, right? Well I think I averaged 270 for the first four games, and Rubio was just not happy, he goes 'You're supposed to be the weak link!' And they were just not happy, but I ran them over.
9/10/2009
One of the most storied places in bowling lore is reserved for the legendary "action bowling" scene that flourished in the New York City area throughout the 1950s and 1960s. One man who remains unimpressed, though, is PBA Hall of Famer Del Ballard Jr. "New York's overrated," Ballard said recently when he sat down with BOWL.com and took us back to a time in Texas when a 17-year-old Norm Duke averaged 250 standing on one lane and lofting the ball over the gutter cap of the next, when even the flawless David Ozio's 230 average that particular night was not enough to win a single game as Ballard went penniless betting on him, when hardly anyone beyond the county line was yet to hear the names of Duke, Ozio or Ballard. But by the time those names were known from coast to coast, New York, too, got a taste of Texas action when Ballard and the boys from back home stopped in at the famed Deer Park Lanes in Long Island for action whenever the PBA Tour came to the northeast. And it was there, in a center so wild and crowded that spectators found their seats on ball returns to get a glimpse of the action and people held the door when players of Ballard's stature arrived, that Ballard understood why New York is the place where action bowling is done like nowhere else. Here, Del Ballard Jr. takes a trip back down memory lane and remembers a co*ky Bob Vespi standing on a ball return in Deer Park with his hands in the air to taunt a rattled Rudy "Revs" Kasimakis after a clutch double in the tenth, the action matches Norm Duke bowled for as much as $10,000 a game, and many more great memories from his days in the action.
Del, you hear a lot of action stories out of the northeast, but every once in a while you also hear stories out of Texas involving the likes of Norm Duke, David Ozio, yourself and others. What memories do you have of bowling action down in Texas back in the day?
DB: New York's overrated. Norm and I go way back. Seven straight weeks he came over after we bowled league on Tuesday nights, and we bowled for $1,000 a game, $2,000 on totals. So, yeah, you can say we've been around.
And this was in the early 1980s, before you went on tour?
DB: 1980, '81. I was about 18. This was before I went out on tour. Norm might have just gone out, he's about a year younger than me. The first real action match I remember, Norm bowled David Ozio at a bowling center in Corpus Christi right after a regional in 1981 at Buckeye Lanes. It was a two-sided AMF place, and they hooked a mile. Anytime you bowled there the humidity and salt water were horrible for the lanes and the surface was terrible. I don't know what they were bowling for but it was a lot of money, and there was another guy from the Houston area named Larry Thompson who was a huge action bowler back then too.
The three of them got down on a pair and I was helping them keep score. This was like my second regional ever and I am down there helping them keep score, and of course I am betting on David Ozio, he looked like the greatest bowler I had ever seen. Norm was averaging 250 and they were hooking so much he was standing on the left lane approach bowling on the right lane, walking around the ball return and throwing it over the gutter cap. At 17 years old he knew how to do that. And all I remember Larry Thompson doing is turning his back and looking at us and saying ‘Now how am I supposed to beat that?' And Ozio averaged 230 and couldn't win a game. That was one of the most remarkable performances I have ever seen. I lost all the money I had in my pocket, all $250 of it.
So you were betting on Ozio against Duke?
DB: Oh, absolutely! You would watch Ozio throw it and think ‘How could this guy ever lose?' And I knew Norm was good but that day I learned that it was tough to beat Norm Duke. I didn't bowl Ozio much action, but I bowled a lot of action against Norm. Joe Vito used to come up on Tuesday nights too from San Antonio. Joe Vito and Norm Duke were the two biggest action bowlers. You ask anyone from Texas and they will tell you Joe Vito was the best money bowler ever. He was just phenomenal. Those were fun times, fun times. I bowled Rudy a couple times too.
Rudy Revs?
DB: Yeah, I bowled him a couple times up at Deer Park Lanes in Long Island. When the tour was up there we'd always bowl action. I bowled a lot of action up there. Guys like Bob Perry, Rudy a couple times, Bob Vespi bowled Rudy there. That was a great match.
What do you remember about the Vespi-Rudy matches? You hear stories about those two bowling action to this day.
DB: Oh, they were great matches. Great matches. Not only did I see those matches, I was backing those matches. I had to be there for the action! I was always around where the action was. This was when Vespi was good on tour and all I remember is that it was crazy. People were all over the approaches sitting on the ball returns trying to watch, sitting on the pairs. It was crazy.
Now, every time Rudy needed one he would throw it right through the face. And all I remember is Vespi got up and doubled in the tenth to make him get the first one, and he turned around and stood up on the ball return with his arms out and said ‘Well, we know whose shot it is now! And we know what's gonna happen! Does everybody in here know what's gonna happen?' And Rudy throws it right through the face.
But Rudy himself has such a huge reputation as an action bowler, so I would imagine that there were nights when Rudy was unbeatable too?
DB: Well I would imagine so, yes, but it also depends on who you're bowling. You know, when the tour comes to town it's a different story than when you're bowling local people. I mean, that's a little different. I don't know where Rudy developed all the reputation from because I wasn't around. But when the tour came to town we didn't care who he was. We didn't care who we were bowling against.
You say "We." Who else was involved in these action matches when the tour came to Long Island?
DB: Well it was me, Norm, Ozio would bowl action up there, Doug Kent is a great action bowler. Now, Norm got matches that I was never a part of, matches where they were bowling for big money.
How much money are we talking about?
DB: Oh, between $5,000 and $10,000.
Per game?
DB: Oh, yeah! But see they'd do it differently there. Up there they do a deal where you get all the money on one side, and then the other side has to match that money. That's how you get the fans involved. You go around and get a hundred bucks a piece from thirty guys, I mean, that's $3,000. The bowler would put up about $1,500 of his own money and collect another $3,000 or $4,000 from the back and now you're bowling for $5,000.
But it's not like the bowlers themselves are bowling for all that money to come into their pocket, right? Not when all these other people are betting on the match.
DB: Right. The bowler puts up the amount of money he wants to make, or the bowler's backer.
So if Norm Duke is paying $1,500 out of pocket but other people are betting $3,000 on the match Norm himself is just bowling for the $1,500, right?
DB: Exactly. That's how they get the whole bowling center involved.
So that's why the whole place became such a riot?
DB: Right. East coast action is different from the action down here. Up there they involved the crowd. Nothing is better than walking into Deer Park where there are about 2,000 people in a place that normally holds about a thousand people all up on the approaches and they hold the door open for you when you walk in. I mean they actually make you feel pretty special, because you're the action. That was the fun part. We used to have a great time. Great times.
Now that would get me back into bowling more. That's when it's fun.
Well what happened to those times, Del? Why have they gone away?
DB: Well, if you can "trick" it and you can do the right thing and average 270, it doesn't matter how good you are. It's more about how you can find the right trick.
What do you mean by "find the right trick"?
DB: Well, like guys I bowled with up in Long Island. They had this little trick gutter shot. Norm is one of the best gutter players of all time and he had a hard time beating the guy because it's like boards one and two hooked, but if you hit one too early it went through the nose, and if you hit three you would miss the headpin to the right. Norm practiced the gutter shot when he was a kid, he grew up on the same lane machine that I did, but he grew up on the one-to-one pattern, not the three-to-three pattern.
Does your wife Carolyn Dorin-Ballard ever bowl any action?
DB: Oh, yeah, locally around here when they're bowling pot games and stuff like that.
Well I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not bowling Carolyn for any amount of money.
DB: I know I can't beat her. She just laughs at me.
What about Del Ballard Jr. in 2009? Are you still bowling much these days, looking for any action at all?
DB: Oh, no. I spend all my extra time hanging out with my daughter. If there was some action going on I wouldn't mind going a little bit. Not bowling, just betting on the action. I like the action. Just a few years ago I bowled a couple of guys, Alex Cavagnaro and Rubio when I was bowling up there at Carolier. We were there and went over to Strike 'N Spare or whatever it was, and Chris Johnson and I went over to bowl them and you know I'm not any good anymore, everybody beats me, right? Well I think I averaged 270 for the first four games, and Rubio was just not happy, he goes 'You're supposed to be the weak link!' And they were just not happy, but I ran them over.